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	<title>Comments on: On Edupunk</title>
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		<title>By: EDUPUNK Battle Royale, Pt. 1 at cac.ophony.org</title>
		<link>http://cac.ophony.org/2008/06/06/on-edupunk/comment-page-1/#comment-37677</link>
		<dc:creator>EDUPUNK Battle Royale, Pt. 1 at cac.ophony.org</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Feb 2009 00:00:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cac.ophony.org/2008/06/06/on-edupunk/#comment-37677</guid>
		<description>[...] might recall some discussion here of &#8220;edupunk,&#8221; a term coined by our old friend Jim Groom to describe approaches to [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] might recall some discussion here of &#8220;edupunk,&#8221; a term coined by our old friend Jim Groom to describe approaches to [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Luke</title>
		<link>http://cac.ophony.org/2008/06/06/on-edupunk/comment-page-1/#comment-33785</link>
		<dc:creator>Luke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 13:35:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cac.ophony.org/2008/06/06/on-edupunk/#comment-33785</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the comment, Aggie.  I agree with most of this, and my idea was to signal that even though I&#039;m not a fan of punk, I still find use in it as a metaphor.  Perhaps, though, there&#039;s a relationship between that choice and my love of affirmative music and cultural styles.  I&#039;d have to disagree that the politics of funk and soul are less evident-- let&#039;s pause here to say this is a discussion about the politics of musical genres, not an argument about pedagogy.

Curtis Mayfield, Sly Stone, Marvin Gaye, James Brown, Stevie Wonder-- each of their musics had a particular political center, ranging from social criticism to collectivism to black nationalism to even, at times, hedonism, and they each produced both welcoming and politically-challenging, moment-transcendent music.  And, frankly, I think the world would be a lot better if everyone were pleasant to one another; so why isn&#039;t that a viable political stance?

Now, anyone who is looking solely to music for their politics is, in my view, casting the net too narrowly, but soundtracks are important and motivational and can help give (some) shape to a movement.   Whatever gets you going, and gets other folks on-board, far&#039;s I&#039;m concerned.  Punk, funk, or polka.  

On that note, here&#039;s a link to Darando&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Jl1YR_J_gM&quot; title=&quot;Darando&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&quot;Let My People Go.&quot;&lt;/a&gt; Great line:  “Man build a rocket ship, take it to the moon; million dollar mission, just to bring back a piece of rock.  We got starvation, panic over the land, and here’s a fool in a rocketship, trying to be Superman”.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the comment, Aggie.  I agree with most of this, and my idea was to signal that even though I&#8217;m not a fan of punk, I still find use in it as a metaphor.  Perhaps, though, there&#8217;s a relationship between that choice and my love of affirmative music and cultural styles.  I&#8217;d have to disagree that the politics of funk and soul are less evident&#8211; let&#8217;s pause here to say this is a discussion about the politics of musical genres, not an argument about pedagogy.</p>
<p>Curtis Mayfield, Sly Stone, Marvin Gaye, James Brown, Stevie Wonder&#8211; each of their musics had a particular political center, ranging from social criticism to collectivism to black nationalism to even, at times, hedonism, and they each produced both welcoming and politically-challenging, moment-transcendent music.  And, frankly, I think the world would be a lot better if everyone were pleasant to one another; so why isn&#8217;t that a viable political stance?</p>
<p>Now, anyone who is looking solely to music for their politics is, in my view, casting the net too narrowly, but soundtracks are important and motivational and can help give (some) shape to a movement.   Whatever gets you going, and gets other folks on-board, far&#8217;s I&#8217;m concerned.  Punk, funk, or polka.  </p>
<p>On that note, here&#8217;s a link to Darando&#8217;s <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Jl1YR_J_gM" title="Darando" rel="nofollow">&#8220;Let My People Go.&#8221;</a> Great line:  “Man build a rocket ship, take it to the moon; million dollar mission, just to bring back a piece of rock.  We got starvation, panic over the land, and here’s a fool in a rocketship, trying to be Superman”.</p>
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		<title>By: Agnieszka</title>
		<link>http://cac.ophony.org/2008/06/06/on-edupunk/comment-page-1/#comment-33771</link>
		<dc:creator>Agnieszka</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 02:51:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cac.ophony.org/2008/06/06/on-edupunk/#comment-33771</guid>
		<description>Such an interesting post.


Initially I wanted to write about how I disagree with your take on punk. How I think punk philosophy as applied to education, beyond DIY, can be more transformative because it is harder to tamethan, lets&#039; say &quot;funk/soul type of approach to ethics/politics/culture.How it may very well be that punk connotes chaos and rejectionist ethos, but that very refusal often leads to critical and purposeful creation, a meaningful transformation.  Punk seems to me much more politically useful: more challenging, serious, ready for confrontation. Less pleasant?  Sure. Pleasantness should not be criteria for a political stance, or a movement, or a philosophy (even if that’s philosophy of teaching we are talking about)...  


I could say that since punk was more explicitly a political movement it is hard to compare it to funk.  There is certainly a political aspect to soul/funk as an expression of hope and pain from an oppressed community, but the music itself is not focused on political message nearly as much as punk, so they have very different relationships to political interpretation.But none of these movements are monolithic. It drastically changes the definition of what punk means if you are using Sex Pistols, Fugazi, or Green Day as the example of punk. Using punk in the “edu punk” label might  turn some people off but that’s the drawback with any cultural reference. I don’t think people will immediately think of Sid Vicious teaching first graders.

But then I thought, what is the use of debating labels… What’s behind them is what matters. Labels stick or don’t, whether or not they fit. Maybe labels are not so important since, in music at least, it seems many artists hate them, but can do nothing about them. Gram Parsons hated the term &quot;Country Rock&quot; and Tricky/Portishead/Massive attack hated being identified as the Bristol sound. Here is an interesting article about a similar critique of a label using the term &#039;punk&#039; : the idea to replace Cyperpunk with &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.streettech.com/bcp/BCPtext/Manifestos/Ribofunk.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Ribofunk &lt;/a&gt;in the late 90&#039;s.All in all, if edupunk label  sticks and it becomes associated with radical, DIY educational movement with a heavy dose of creativity (even if that is a very simplistic understanding of EP) , that’s be good, no?


BTW, you know what would be even better? EduPolka or EduBluegrass☺</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Such an interesting post.</p>
<p>Initially I wanted to write about how I disagree with your take on punk. How I think punk philosophy as applied to education, beyond DIY, can be more transformative because it is harder to tamethan, lets&#8217; say &#8220;funk/soul type of approach to ethics/politics/culture.How it may very well be that punk connotes chaos and rejectionist ethos, but that very refusal often leads to critical and purposeful creation, a meaningful transformation.  Punk seems to me much more politically useful: more challenging, serious, ready for confrontation. Less pleasant?  Sure. Pleasantness should not be criteria for a political stance, or a movement, or a philosophy (even if that’s philosophy of teaching we are talking about)&#8230;  </p>
<p>I could say that since punk was more explicitly a political movement it is hard to compare it to funk.  There is certainly a political aspect to soul/funk as an expression of hope and pain from an oppressed community, but the music itself is not focused on political message nearly as much as punk, so they have very different relationships to political interpretation.But none of these movements are monolithic. It drastically changes the definition of what punk means if you are using Sex Pistols, Fugazi, or Green Day as the example of punk. Using punk in the “edu punk” label might  turn some people off but that’s the drawback with any cultural reference. I don’t think people will immediately think of Sid Vicious teaching first graders.</p>
<p>But then I thought, what is the use of debating labels… What’s behind them is what matters. Labels stick or don’t, whether or not they fit. Maybe labels are not so important since, in music at least, it seems many artists hate them, but can do nothing about them. Gram Parsons hated the term &#8220;Country Rock&#8221; and Tricky/Portishead/Massive attack hated being identified as the Bristol sound. Here is an interesting article about a similar critique of a label using the term &#8216;punk&#8217; : the idea to replace Cyperpunk with <a href="http://www.streettech.com/bcp/BCPtext/Manifestos/Ribofunk.html" rel="nofollow">Ribofunk </a>in the late 90&#8217;s.All in all, if edupunk label  sticks and it becomes associated with radical, DIY educational movement with a heavy dose of creativity (even if that is a very simplistic understanding of EP) , that’s be good, no?</p>
<p>BTW, you know what would be even better? EduPolka or EduBluegrass☺</p>
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		<title>By: Jim</title>
		<link>http://cac.ophony.org/2008/06/06/on-edupunk/comment-page-1/#comment-33621</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Jun 2008 07:02:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cac.ophony.org/2008/06/06/on-edupunk/#comment-33621</guid>
		<description>Well Luke,

You know I love your style, and I do love funk, and I don&#039;t look half bad with an afro. :) 

More seriously, you nail so many important points here Luke:
&lt;blockquote&gt;At the core of edupunk are older pedagogical stances unrelated to technology: an ethic of self-reliance, the valuation of student-centered experiential learning, and the rejection of the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.webster.edu/~corbetre/philosophy/education/freire/freire-2.html&quot; title=&quot;Banking&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;“banking concept of education.”&lt;/a&gt;    Edupunk seeks to update and adapt these ideas within the rapidly evolving realm of edutech.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Exactly! Brilliant. And to be perfectly honest with you I didn&#039;t think it would be the shot heard around the edublogosphere that it has become, and you hit the mark far better than I could. 

Luckily it is dying down a bit, and we can get to that work that needs to be done.  

Speaking of which, I can&#039;t begin to tell you how excited I am at the prospect that you may be blogging more regularly.  I look forward to that with great anticipation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well Luke,</p>
<p>You know I love your style, and I do love funk, and I don&#39;t look half bad with an afro. <img src='http://cac.ophony.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>More seriously, you nail so many important points here Luke:<br />
&lt;blockquote&gt;At the core of edupunk are older pedagogical stances unrelated to technology: an ethic of self-reliance, the valuation of student-centered experiential learning, and the rejection of the <a href="http://www.webster.edu/~corbetre/philosophy/education/freire/freire-2.html" title="Banking" rel="nofollow">“banking concept of education.”</a>    Edupunk seeks to update and adapt these ideas within the rapidly evolving realm of edutech.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</p>
<p>Exactly! Brilliant. And to be perfectly honest with you I didn&#39;t think it would be the shot heard around the edublogosphere that it has become, and you hit the mark far better than I could. </p>
<p>Luckily it is dying down a bit, and we can get to that work that needs to be done.  </p>
<p>Speaking of which, I can&#39;t begin to tell you how excited I am at the prospect that you may be blogging more regularly.  I look forward to that with great anticipation.</p>
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